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Disconnector- How does it work?

This is a discussion on Disconnector- How does it work? within the Ruger Rimfires forums, part of the Pistol & Revolver Forum category; Originally Posted by Iowegan Just another reason why you shouldn't believe what you see in the movies or on TV with a "stunt gun". Ha ...


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Old January 23rd, 2020, 09:16 AM   #31
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowegan
Just another reason why you shouldn't believe what you see in the movies or on TV with a "stunt gun".
Ha Ha! True that.

It reminds me of a Bonanza episode where the boys were pinned down by bad guys hiding up in a rock formation. They shot one of the bad guys by planning a ricochet based on how a cue ball bounces of a pool table rail. Of course that fictional shot sent the rest of the bad guys running.



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Old January 23rd, 2020, 10:13 AM   #32
 
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Originally Posted by Iowegan View Post
Nomadic Paladin, It's Hollywood Ö. meaning it isn't real. If it was real, the sear would have to lock into the hammer notch until the lever was fully seated. In other words, you couldn't just wire the trigger back because the hammer would not stay cocked and would follow the bolt forward and not fire. A "lever operated trigger puller" like RWS mentioned would work but I sure wouldn't want something like that on any lever gun I owned. I remember seeing Chuck Conners operating the lever, taking aim, then pulling the trigger. This just wouldn't work with the "screw in the lever" trick. Just another reason why you shouldn't believe what you see in the movies or on TV with a "stunt gun".
Yes I was referring to Chuck Conners and I know it wasn't real. I was just wondering how it would or if it could be done in real life. I would not think the screw would work well since the trigger would be activated only when the lever was "opened", but what do I know.
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Old January 23rd, 2020, 10:50 AM   #33
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If you look closely at a Winchester lever gun (designed by John Browning) they actually have a real disconnector. It is a plunger type device located under the lever (just behind the trigger) so when the lever is in the fully closed positioned, the disconnector plunger is pushed up, which allows the sear to be released when pulling the trigger. If the lever isn't all the way closed, the gun won't fire. Yet another type of disconnector to add to the list.
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Old January 23rd, 2020, 04:53 PM   #34
 
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To boil an elephant down to a pork chop...

In semi-auto, when the trigger is actuated and the action cycles, and the trigger is held to the rear, the disconnector holds onto the hammer. When the trigger is released and “reset,” the disconnector releases the hammer and the trigger grabs it. That’s why you hear the “click” sound - the hammer disengaging the disconnector and engaging the trigger.

In full-auto mode, the safety switch blocks the disconnector from grabbing the hammer when the action cycles. As long as the trigger is depressed, there is nothing to grab the hammer when the action cycles, so the firearm continues to fire. When the trigger is released it grabs the hammer, not the disconnector. That’s why when you shoot on full-auto you don’t have to reset the trigger.

Sorry, forgot to say that the best demonstration for how the disconnector works is to take the dust cover and recoil spring and guide off an AK and then watch the inner workings and the relationships between the hammer, trigger, disconnector, and safety. Granted you won’t be able to see how the full-auto works unless you have access to a NFA specimen, but you’ll get the idea.

Also, I know there are a lot of different types of disconnector mechanisms, but the basic principle is the same.

Last edited by JohnnyAuto757; January 23rd, 2020 at 05:19 PM. Reason: Forgot stuff
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Old January 23rd, 2020, 05:37 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by JohnnyAuto757 View Post

In full-auto mode, the safety switch blocks the disconnector from grabbing the hammer when the action cycles. As long as the trigger is depressed, there is nothing to grab the hammer when the action cycles, so the firearm continues to fire. When the trigger is released it grabs the hammer, not the disconnector. Thatís why when you shoot on full-auto you donít have to reset the trigger.
in the case of the M16 in full auto mode...the selector switch blocks the disconnector from grabbing the hammer but now the auto sear grabs the hammer until the bolt closes which then trips the auto sear releasing the hammer and continues this cycle until trigger is released or magazine runs dry.
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Old January 23rd, 2020, 06:15 PM   #36
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True ^^^^
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Old January 24th, 2020, 09:02 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowegan View Post
If you look closely at a Winchester lever gun (designed by John Browning) they actually have a real disconnector. It is a plunger type device located under the lever (just behind the trigger) so when the lever is in the fully closed positioned, the disconnector plunger is pushed up, which allows the sear to be released when pulling the trigger. If the lever isn't all the way closed, the gun won't fire. Yet another type of disconnector to add to the list.
yes... on modern guns... but I don't see it on original 1892's. If you could possibly point it out by part number I'd appreciate it.

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Old January 25th, 2020, 08:12 AM   #38
 
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In a 1911, the disconnector is a physical coupling between the trigger and sear. Without it, the trigger or bow of the trigger would simple move past, just under the sear feet. With it, the trigger bow pushes against the disconnector which pushes against the sear, releasing the hammer to fire. Upon firing, the slide actuates the disconnector, pushing it down, allowing it to slip under the feet of the sear via the trigger bow when pulling back on the trigger. It all happens so fast. The sear is, at that point, floating under its own spring pressure and allowed to lock back into the hammer via the slide, (firing cycle).

When the slide returns forward, it allows the disconnector to spring back up in between the trigger bow and sear... but waight... you still have the trigger pulled back which is holding the disconnector trapped under the feet of the sear. The slide only allows it to return but the trigger has to allow it also. The trigger has to move forward to allow the disconnector to get back up and in between the trigger bow and sear. Trigger forward... click... reset has occurred. The click is the disconnector popping upward as the trigger bow brings the disconnector to the edge of the sear feet.

You see... the disconnector is under its own spring pressure "center leaf" of the sear spring. The disconnector is springing upward as well as forward by design. It follows the trigger bow. Just prior to reset, the disconnector is physically trapped under the feet of the sear, held by the bow. It can't spring back up until the trigger by has brought the disconnector to the forward edge of the sear feet and just beyond. Kind of like falling off a cliff in reverse.

There's a term called pre-travel which is the amount of spacing needed to allow for a reset and some smiths have said on the 1911 forum that if your 1911 won't allow a reset at the safety notch, there is not enough pre travel space. It was also said that most production 1911's won't reset from the safety notch position. That's another discussion.
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Old January 25th, 2020, 08:22 AM   #39
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rws, 1894s and after have the lever disconnector.
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Old January 25th, 2020, 10:57 AM   #40
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjohnson1 View Post
I understand that the disconnector on a pistol allows the pistol to fire only when the trigger is pulled, preventing a semi auto pistol from malfunctioning into automatic fire. (I hope I'm right on that). What I don't understand is how it does it - how it works? Can someone explain? Thanks
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One of the better ways to see how a disconnector works is to look at an AR 15 I know it is not a handgun but the way the disconnector works is similar and you can see how it works.

If you have an AR or have a friend who does open the upper from the lower cock the hammer manually, make sure to put your thumb in front of the hammer so it will not hit the lower and then pull the trigger. The hammer will go forward then holding the trigger back cock the hammer again. With the trigger held back the disconnector will keep the hammer from engaging with the sear until you let the trigger go foreword.

All disconnectors work in a similar fashion whether a handgun or rifle the disconnector prevents the hammer and sear from engaging until the trigger is released to go forward.
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Old January 25th, 2020, 11:23 AM   #41
 
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The disconnector in a 1911 allows for re-engagement of the sear with the hammer during a cycle by decoupling the trigger from the sear (freeing it) while the trigger is held back. It would otherwise hold back the sear from engaging with the hammer and the hammer would just follow back with the slide. I know nothing about the ARs or how similar the disconnector functions.

Last edited by Russ123; January 25th, 2020 at 06:26 PM.
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Old January 25th, 2020, 02:52 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by Iowegan View Post
rws, 1894s and after have the lever disconnector.
So do you agree the 1892 rifle is fully capable of using a set screw in the lever to trip the trigger being there is no trigger stop in this model?



.

Last edited by rws; January 27th, 2020 at 02:07 AM.
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Old January 27th, 2020, 12:00 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Iowegan View Post
Nomadic Paladin, It's Hollywood …. meaning it isn't real. If it was real, the sear would have to lock into the hammer notch until the lever was fully seated. In other words, you couldn't just wire the trigger back because the hammer would not stay cocked and would follow the bolt forward and not fire. A "lever operated trigger puller" like RWS mentioned would work but I sure wouldn't want something like that on any lever gun I owned. I remember seeing Chuck Conners operating the lever, taking aim, then pulling the trigger. This just wouldn't work with the "screw in the lever" trick. Just another reason why you shouldn't believe what you see in the movies or on TV with a "stunt gun".
it's easy to research stuff...

maybe this will help...the screw was adjustable...could be backed off for non-rapid firing scenes...see picture below showing adjustable screw with lock nut.

clip from Wikipedia

Westerns were popular when The Rifleman premiered, and producers tried to find gimmicks to distinguish one show from another. The Rifleman's gimmick was a modified Winchester Model 1892 rifle, with a large ring lever drilled and tapped for a set screw. The lever design allowed him to cock the rifle by spinning it around his hand. In addition, the screw could be positioned to depress the trigger every time he worked the lever, allowing for rapid fire, emptying the magazine in under five seconds during the opening credits on North Fork's main street.

The trigger-trip screw pin was used in two configurations: with the screw head turned inside (close to the trigger) or, more often, outside the trigger guard with a locknut on the outside (to secure its position). In some episodes, the screw was removed, when rapid-fire action was not required. When properly adjusted, the screw “squeezed” the trigger when the lever was fully closed. The rapid-fire mechanism was originally designed to keep Connors from puncturing his finger with the trigger as he quickly cycled the action of the rifle. With this modification, it was not necessary for Connors to pull the trigger for each shot and therefore he did not have to place his finger in harm's way.

clip from site: The World Golf Hall of Fame
This is the rifle Chuck Connors gave to Arnold Palmer is displayed in the World Golf Hall of Fame. This Rifle was used on The Rifleman


Last edited by rws; January 27th, 2020 at 12:12 PM.
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Old January 27th, 2020, 12:10 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by Iowegan
Just another reason why you shouldn't believe what you see in the movies or on TV with a "stunt gun".

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Originally Posted by TestEngineer View Post
Ha Ha! True that.
I'm surprised you being a "mechanical kind of guy" agreeing with Iowegan on this matter.
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Old January 27th, 2020, 04:18 PM   #45
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rws, I'm not sure where you are going with this … let's not turn it into an argument. I really had no idea how the "Rifleman's" rifle was set up, never gave it much thought, and honestly don't care. My guess would have been to have two prop guns …. one with some type of lever actuated trigger and another without. Now we know!
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