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10/22 Takedown

This is a discussion on 10/22 Takedown within the Ruger 10/22 Rimfire forums, part of the Rifle & Shotgun Forum category; What rail mount, scope, scope mount did you choose and why? Seems there is a problem with holding zero with this rifle....


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Old December 17th, 2019, 07:43 AM   #1
 
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10/22 Takedown

What rail mount, scope, scope mount did you choose and why? Seems there is a problem with holding zero with this rifle.



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Old December 17th, 2019, 08:04 AM   #2
 
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I used the rail that came with it with a UTG Bugbuster and no problem holding zero if you have the tension nut tightened properly
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Old December 17th, 2019, 08:05 AM   #3
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Mikey95hd, As I tried to explain in your previous thread, it's not the scope …. it's the way the gun is designed as a take down. Any time you have a receiver mounted scope …. no matter what brand or type, you will potentially have accuracy issues because the barrel mounting system is not perfectly repeatable. I also noted …. a cantilever base on the barrel with a conventional rimfire scope or scout type barrel mount with a long eye relief rimfire scope solves the problem.

My TD has a 4X30mm fixed power rimfire scope with the factory scope base mounted on the receiver. It will hold a couple inch group at 50 yards …. plenty good for a gun designed for survival or just plinking. If you want more precision accuracy and don't want to go with a barrel mount, you probably bought the wrong rifle.

I'm sure other members will chime in with their scope and scope mount recommendations.
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Old December 17th, 2019, 09:11 AM   #4
 
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I bought this rifle, due to the fact it does break down for a smaller package, just expect something that is accurate, and repeatable. Then maybe I should buy another one that is accurate for better groups.
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Old December 17th, 2019, 11:06 AM   #5
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Mikey95hd, I bought my TD with the same concept in mind as you. I also own 3 other 10/22s. My custom build is very accurate but my standard carbine and my Manlicher stock 10/22 have mediocre accuracy …. better than my TD but certainly not match grade. I think 10/22s (and TDs) are about the most fun rifles you can own, even if they aren't the most accurate.

If you want really good accuracy, I would highly recommend a bolt action rifle. Ruger now makes the Precision Rimfire Rifle and although I have not fired one yet, they have established a good reputation for accuracy. I own several 22 LR rifles with my CZ 452 being the most accurate and the least fussy about ammo. Some of my other very accurate rifles are a Remington 512 (bolt action, clip fed) and a Marlin 39A (lever action tube fed). All of these rifles will shoot sub-inch groups at 100 yards providing I use the ammo they like.

Here's my CZ 452 with a Nikon 3-9X EFR Rimfire Scope… a superb 22 LR rifle. There are more accurate rifles available but break out your wallet because they will cost you a small fortune.

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Old December 17th, 2019, 01:22 PM   #6
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowegan View Post
If you want really good accuracy, I would highly recommend a bolt action rifle.
definitely agree w/this... i think the 10/22 is pretty good for a semiauto (based on my limited experience and poor eyesight), although there are folks who are shooting very well (e.g., .05" 5-shot 50-yard, single-hole groups)...

one fellow did a shoot-out:

Ultimate 10/22 Shootout Test

with some tabled results:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...Zgo/edit#gid=0

more info than i can absorb in an afternoon!

but i have had good enough results for me with my 10/22 TD... here's one 25-yd target immediately after scope re-attachment and re-assembly (i cycle the bolt several times before putting in a magazine and chambering):



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Old December 17th, 2019, 07:09 PM   #7
 
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Iím going to go +1 on the CZ 452. Mine is a 452 Special I found at gun show. A rare deal at gun show for me. Put a Nikon rimfire scope on it right away. It is a tack driver. My 10/22 takedown has been very accurate so far. It is probably because it has not yet been taken down since I bought it.
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Old December 17th, 2019, 08:33 PM   #8
 
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I will be using my ruger pcc mainly with a red dot.
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Old December 18th, 2019, 05:28 AM   #9
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikey95hd View Post
Seems there is a problem with holding zero with this rifle.
As Iowegan suggested, if you can take the barrel on and off, you have to live with the fact that it's nearly impossible to remount the barrel and have a consistent POI. (Except in spy movies). The iron sights should be OK, receiver mounted sights, not so much.

The take down feature solves a problem with storage and transport. It fits anywhere, and you can't actually tell it's a gun when carrying it around. Accuracy for clay birds at 25yds in a gravel pit with the irons, excellent. Keeping up with the 10/22's with a target barrel, not a chance.
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Old December 18th, 2019, 10:50 AM   #10
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linux_author, Your targets pretty much emulate the ones I have shot at 25 yards …. quite good. However at farther distances, there are other issues that tend to spread groups out …. especially with factory 10/22 barrels and more so with TDs as noted by TMan51. Here's what happens:

Chambers in factory 10/22 barrels are quite "generous", which helps cartridges feed better without jamming, however loose chambers contribute to bullet damage because the cartridges are not aligned perfectly with the bore and get a slightly off set start.

The way 10/22s are designed to feed is almost guarantied to cause some minor bullet damage. Further, bores in factory 10/22 barrels are far from perfect where the diameter can vary from end to end and the depth of the rifling can be slightly different for each land. These minor discrepancies cause slight bullet damage but as long as the bullet is spinning fast enough to maintain stability, accuracy will be quite good.

Herein lies the problem with most factory 10/22s …. after about 50 yards, the bullet's velocity and spin rate have slowed down quite notably but accuracy is still decent. It seems in most 10/22s, accuracy starts to decline at about 60 yards and gets progressively worse as the bullet travels farther down range. This is where slight bullet damage overcomes the bullet's decayed spin rate and starts going into a spiral, which opens up groups.

When match grade aftermarket barrels are used on 10/22s with match grade ammo, they will maintain tight groups at notably farther distances (my custom 10/22 will hold 1 MOA groups at 100 yards). Why? Bullet damage has been minimized …. match grade cartridges have near prefect bullets and match grade barrels have a very uniform bore diameter, precision rifling lands, and snug headspace. These attributes combine and produce results far superior to standard factory 10/22 configurations.

I enjoy taking measurements and correlating those measurement into meaningful results …. in this case, accuracy. Here's some measurements from my CZ 452 versus a factory 10/22:

Headspace in my 10/22 Carbine is a generous .020" whereas in my CZ, it is .002". Chamber diameter in my 10/22 is .227" but only .225" in my CZ. The biggest difference is the bore diameter …. a pin gauge that fits freely in my 10/22 won't even start in the muzzle of my CZ. This is because the lands are more pronounced, making the distance between lands about .002" tighter in the CZ. BTW, on a calm day, my CZ will hold sub-inch groups at 100 yards with normal high velocity ammo and does even better with match grade ammo with my best groups measuring just .5" with Wolf Target/Match 22 LR ammo.

Last edited by Iowegan; December 18th, 2019 at 11:33 AM.
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Old December 19th, 2019, 03:39 AM   #11
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I built my 10/22 TD into a switch barrel rifle. I've got the factory barrel that is either iron sights or uses a SeeAll sight on the Magpul rail (X22 Backpacker stock), then I have a Volquartsen cantilever barrel on it with a UTG 2-16 scope. The scoped barrel shoots about 1.5-2" at 100 yards with Minimags, though I've not shot it all that much yet, and that is outdoors with wind. It likely is capable of better. I used the Magpul Hunter forend on that barrel with a bipod.
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Old December 19th, 2019, 05:38 AM   #12
 
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I used the Williams Ace in the Hole sight/rail set on both of my 10/22 carbines..~$50. The rear peep sight has different sight hole sizes available. The front sight is fiber optic.

On the Stain”s”Less TakeDown model I added a 2MOA Red Dot to the Williams Rail and love the combo. I can see the fiber optic front sight over the red dot skeleton mount...which was a major plus.

I generally shoot at 42-50 yds. at my home range..and test zero closer. At that distance I’m just fun-shooting at various AR500 targets.

Last edited by MountainHunter; December 19th, 2019 at 06:40 AM.
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Old December 19th, 2019, 06:39 AM   #13
 
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I never spend time trying to get super accurate on my 10/22 takedown, or my marlin 60. My basic test with the semi .22's is how well it reliably cycles just about any kind of ammo. I can shoot offhand with either of them at 50 yds with iron sights and hit a 10" target, that's good enough for me. I use a bolt action for real accuracy.
I'm probably not the norm though.

I do have a fixed 4x scope on my 10/22 TD and at 50 yds I can keep maybe a 2" group (mostly just me not the gun) and at 100yds that opens up a little. I am not that steady of a shooter, I mostly need more practice.
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Old December 21st, 2019, 03:06 PM   #14
 
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With the Takedown, if you mount a scope, barrel lockup tension is critical.
Iron sights are both on the barrel. No issue with a slight barrel wobble.
A scope is mounted on the reciever. If barrel moves, shot is off.
Too loose, the barrel has wobble, scope stays firm on reciever.
Too tight, you will have a devil of a time getting the barrel off.

Instructions are on page 15/16. Do it a few times, and you will find the sweet spot.
I usually check the adjustment every 3-4 times I remove the barrel. Or if I can jiggle the barrel.
It gets to be second nature. Then you will be much more happy.

However; the 10-22 Takedown just is not in the super accurate class.
Like lowegan said, that starts costing money. Enjoy the 10-22 for what it is.

Last edited by jnichols2; December 21st, 2019 at 03:53 PM.
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Old December 27th, 2019, 04:58 PM   #15
 
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10/22TD Is Sweet

My first firearm is/was a 10/22TD, purchased in February 2015, at the ripe age of 54 years - that would be me, the shooter - the rifle was new! I immediately added the Tech-Sights irons, front and back; I never shot it with the factory sights. About 5 months later, I bought a Mini-14 in 300BLK.

The picture below is from my first-ever shooting on a 100yd line. I figure the results are okay enough. A flier with each rifle, but the rest are pretty close, given the weather conditions, the eyeballs, and the irons.

During the time between February and December, when the picture was made, I hit a local indoor, 25yd, range 2-3 times per week, most weeks. I'd guess I put 6,000 to 8,000 rounds through the 22 during that period. I was trying to get better and maybe, just maybe, catch up with my daughter's marksmanship ability. The point there is that the 10/22 was taken down a LOT during those months. I rarely adjusted the sights. In 2016, I continued with the regular visits to the range, the number of rounds, and the take downs of the rifle. I think I adjusted the ring-tensioner once and haven't touched the sights since maybe Q3 2016. My daughter or I just grab the rifle, assemble it, load it, aim, and fire; we haven't perceived any changes in how it shoots or it's zero. That danged thing is just sweet, at least to us.


FYI - the 7 "black-claw" holes are 300BLK from the Mini. I shot those first.
The other 10 holes are 22. The 2 "AP-1" holes, near the top were "registration" shots, to assess the drop. The other 8, including the flier, were aimed at "AP-2". It was a cloudy, rainy, occasionally blustery day, light was fading, and range would be closing, so there was nothing too calculated, clean, surgical, or whatever about the shots. I was still a "rookie" shooter, too.

So, I was happy with those results.

Just wanted to share my experience with our 10/22TD.

Also, the folks at Tech-Sights are great, too.

My $0.02,
Steve in Memphis

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