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Blackhawk/Wolff Springs...

This is a discussion on Blackhawk/Wolff Springs... within the Ruger Single Action forums, part of the Pistol & Revolver Forum category; Well since I am getting advice on the base pin/cylinder removal at this site, I have another question. As I have previously stated, I have ...


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Old February 9th, 2008, 06:20 AM   #1
 
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Blackhawk/Wolff Springs...

Well since I am getting advice on the base pin/cylinder removal at this site, I have another question.

As I have previously stated, I have the double action Rugers and I don’t have many questions about them! I have changed the springs in all of them to Wolff springs. I shoot them all double action much of the time and I get very good accuracy. ‘Course that comes with much practice.

The question: Has anyone here changed the springs in their Blackhawk using Wolff springs? Wolff offers several different combos and I am just curious as to what weight of springs people have used, and what the success was, before I order.

Thanks…BCB



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Old February 9th, 2008, 06:55 AM   #2
 
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Cool Springs

BCB ~ Well not WOLF, but I have changed springs in a couple down through the years. I have to say, I was never happy with the results in the end. Just me I suppose, and I am sure the experience of others will differ. One thing for sure, if you are not happy with the results, you can always reverse the. One thing, and this goes for just about ANY thing you remove. Sights, grips, etc.. Always bag, and mark where they came from. The old "I will remember" will go out the door faster than you think. Fool around with this stuff enough and you will have all kind of things around. The older you get, and more you have going on in your life, the worse it can get.
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Old February 9th, 2008, 07:43 AM   #3
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Trigger springs are worth replacing with lighter ones but hammer springs are a different story. SA revolvers are one of the most accurate hand guns available but are also the hardest to master for marksmanship. The reason .... lock time is longer than any other type of gun. Lock time is the time it takes for the hammer to fall once you release the sear (pull the trigger). Examples: a typical DA revolver has a lock time of 40 milliseconds (.040 seconds) where as a typical SA revolver has a 75 ms lock time. A typical striker pistol has 25 ms lock time. This fraction of a second doesn't seem like much but indeed it is when it comes to how far your hands can move the muzzle in that time. A lighter hammer spring increases lock time by a proportionate amount. Example: a factory 23 lb spring is replaced with a 19 lb spring. That's a 18% change so you can expect lock time to increase by about 18% too. (over 88 ms).

Here's what muzzle movement does to your groups ... with an average barrel length revolver, each .007" of muzzle movement accounts for an inch of change in point of impact at 25 yards. Look at your thumbnail ... most are about .035" thick. Barrel movement the thickness of your thumbnail will drive the bullet off its mark by 5" @ 25 yds.

So instead of a lighter hammer spring, you might consider a stronger one. Yes, I know ... you want the trigger pull as light as possible. The trigger spring will help a great deal with that. When you lighten the trigger pull, you also increase the feel of creep (trigger sear movement). To me, creep is way more annoying than a stronger pull so you may need to polish the sear surfaces.

Here's something that most shooters don't consider ... what happens after the trigger is pulled? Yes, you should be very concerned about holding the firearm still while aiming and a light trigger pull is desirable but your job isn't over when the sear releases. Because of lock time, you have to keep the sights on target until you feel the recoil. If you move sooner, the bullet won't hit where you aimed. Post sear release is responsible for all sorts of issues such as anticipating recoil (shooting low), palming (shooting high), or trigger finger placement ... shooting left or right depending on how much trigger finger was used. Bottom line, grips and hammer springs have a huge influence on post sear release just as trigger pull and sights do with pre-sear release. Both are equally important for good marksmanship.
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Old February 9th, 2008, 09:37 AM   #4
 
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I Really need an IBOK on Ruger Single Actions...................
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Old February 9th, 2008, 02:31 PM   #5
 
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Also to light a trigger spring may not reset the trigger. Some people try this but I've never got one exactly right to suit me.
Baker

http://www.cylindersmith.com/triggerspring.html
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Old February 13th, 2008, 11:00 AM   #6
 
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I have used those spring kits in single six and vaquero liked both made accuracy better as not pullnig off target when letting fly!!!Good luck with blackhawk I had .41 with 4 5/8 barrel that i wish i would not traded off!!!
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Old February 18th, 2008, 09:14 AM   #7
 
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Listen to Iowegan. He speaks the truth. To me the Blackhawk is set up just about right for most I have shot. There is a trick you can do to reshape the existing trigger spring, and that is about all that is needed. Polishing the sear surfaces on a real rough or gritty trigger would ne next if needed. I don't have the link to the trigger spring trick, but someone else will list it I'm sure.
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Old January 15th, 2009, 10:02 AM   #8
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowegan View Post
Trigger springs are worth replacing with lighter ones but hammer springs are a different story. SA revolvers are one of the most accurate hand guns available but are also the hardest to master for marksmanship. The reason .... lock time is longer than any other type of gun. Lock time is the time it takes for the hammer to fall once you release the sear (pull the trigger). Examples: a typical DA revolver has a lock time of 40 milliseconds (.040 seconds) where as a typical SA revolver has a 75 ms lock time. A typical striker pistol has 25 ms lock time. This fraction of a second doesn't seem like much but indeed it is when it comes to how far your hands can move the muzzle in that time. A lighter hammer spring increases lock time by a proportionate amount. Example: a factory 23 lb spring is replaced with a 19 lb spring. That's a 18% change so you can expect lock time to increase by about 18% too. (over 88 ms).

Here's what muzzle movement does to your groups ... with an average barrel length revolver, each .007" of muzzle movement accounts for an inch of change in point of impact at 25 yards. Look at your thumbnail ... most are about .035" thick. Barrel movement the thickness of your thumbnail will drive the bullet off its mark by 5" @ 25 yds.

So instead of a lighter hammer spring, you might consider a stronger one. Yes, I know ... you want the trigger pull as light as possible. The trigger spring will help a great deal with that. When you lighten the trigger pull, you also increase the feel of creep (trigger sear movement). To me, creep is way more annoying than a stronger pull so you may need to polish the sear surfaces.

Here's something that most shooters don't consider ... what happens after the trigger is pulled? Yes, you should be very concerned about holding the firearm still while aiming and a light trigger pull is desirable but your job isn't over when the sear releases. Because of lock time, you have to keep the sights on target until you feel the recoil. If you move sooner, the bullet won't hit where you aimed. Post sear release is responsible for all sorts of issues such as anticipating recoil (shooting low), palming (shooting high), or trigger finger placement ... shooting left or right depending on how much trigger finger was used. Bottom line, grips and hammer springs have a huge influence on post sear release just as trigger pull and sights do with pre-sear release. Both are equally important for good marksmanship.
Wow, I can't believe how much I'm learning here. Thanks!
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Old January 16th, 2009, 02:39 PM   #9
 
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I installed a Wolff 30 oz. trigger spring in my Blackhawk. It made a lot of difference in accuracy. I believe that the factory trigger spring is 54 oz. Before I did it I was afraid that it would make the gun unsafe becaue the gun might have a hair-trigger. But that is not the case. I have never had the gun go off accidently. It only fires when I pull the trigger. It was very easy to change the trigger spring. I just removed the wood grips, the pin that holds the spring in place and pulled out the old spring. The pin came out so easy I just had to use a toothpick to push the pin out. Then I slid the new spring in, pushed in the pin with my hand and screwed the grip panels back on. It took all of about 15 minutes from start to finish. It was well worth it.
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Old January 16th, 2009, 04:28 PM   #10
 
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This is what I based my BH trigger work on. I was impressed:

http://www.cylindersmith.com/triggerspring.html
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Old January 16th, 2009, 06:47 PM   #11
 
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Would like to improve the trigger after I can get into the online manuals I'll start working on my NMBH 61/2 357
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Old February 11th, 2009, 05:28 PM   #12
 
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I am humbled. I'd read an Iowegan earlier cutioning against lighter hammer springs and the increased lock time as contribution to accracy problems. Specifically, the context was a SBH 23 pound standard spring versus a light, say 19 pound, aftermarket spring. I indicated it didn't seem like a big enough difference in lock time but it is clear that Iowegan has investigated this in depth and including details and data in this thread.
Thanks Iowegan.
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Old April 3rd, 2009, 01:49 PM   #13
 
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I did the wolf shooters pack with the 17 lb. main, 30 oz trigger, and extra power base pin. also polished the internals, free spin pawl, Houge rubber finger grove grips, and one ragged hole rear sight insert. It has a great trigger now, the sight takes a little to get use to, need to paint the front sight. But havent had any trouble with it not hittin hard enough to fire any factory or reloads i have put through it.
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