Ruger Forum

Zombiehuntclub · June 19th, 2012, 02:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OpsMgr

What???

Did you see the pics above? The size difference between the two pistolas with the 7 round mags is miniscule...

LOL my thoughts exactly. How many words is it that a picture makes?

imaoldfart · June 19th, 2012, 05:50 AM

I went with the LC9 with Galloway upgrades because the Shield is Butt Ugly.

copterpilotguy · June 27th, 2012, 07:02 PM

Note on another way to check RTK trigger is in correct avoiding lite strikes. Remove firing pin from LC9 slide. Assemble gun. Use a flash light look down fire pin hole from back while pulling trigger. You can see the hammer block lift out of the way. If the overtravel screw is set too much the blocker is not fully clear. Make sure its clear and then some.
Some how when I added the RTK trigger to the Galloway bar and hammer it improved pull and break greatly. Maybe mechanical advantage is slightly different. Got to tell ya that it made the LC9 GREAT!!

And its thinner than an MP Shield and best of all lighter. Advantage to the shield is its ready out of the box with no mod but I hate every extra ounce in my pocket or holster. My goal was go balance of firepower i.e. 9mm, weight, sights, thin also like " melted " rounded edges of LC9. I like strikers better than this style hammer but this LC9 is doing for me right now. Sweet.

Fastclient · June 28th, 2012, 05:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by copterpilotguy

Some how when I added the RTK trigger to the Galloway bar and hammer it improved pull and break greatly.

What exactly was improved? Pull weight? Break differently? Can you be a bit more specific? Thanks!

copterpilotguy · June 28th, 2012, 05:44 PM

The pull is lighter weight for some reason with the RTK. I put the RTK on to be able to adjust over travel. It does that just ok because of the fact that if you limit the over travel too much it wont lift the fire pin block as I stated in my last post. Ok so that is not as adjustable as i would have liked. But the pull weight got lighter and it breaks a little nicer as in lighter. Your finger is up furthur so your not using your finger joint to pull the trigger. I think a combination of factors makes the mechanical advantage i.e. leverage a little bit improved making pull weight lighter.

Maybe because of the fact that your more on the lower part of the trigger and the tip of your finger is doing the pulling more than the nuckle joint of your finger. I know that i was reasonably impressed with the galloway install because of the reduction in travel but was totally sold when the RTK improved it. The only thing I didnt like about the gun out of the box was the long pull to the end. It was smooth but took forever to finally break and affected my acuracy. And my finger was half way through the trigger hole because of big hands.
I know as a defense gun that can be an acceptable maybe even desireable characteristic but I like a traditional trigger feel better.

robkarrob · June 30th, 2012, 06:21 PM

Regarding copterpilotguy's review on the RTK Tactical Trigger, the pull weight cannot change. The only thing that changed was the shape of the trigger. The LC9 still has the same springs that control the pull pressure. The RTK trigger is the same length as the stock trigger, so there is no leverage advantage. It may feel differently as the RTK trigger is set more forward in the trigger guard, by around 3/8 inch further than the stock trigger. For someone with a large hand the further you move the trigger forward, the better the pull "should" feel. However the pull is the same length and the pull weight has not changed. Only the trigger location and shape has changed.

I had the RTK Tactical Trigger in my LC9 for about an hour. I did not like it at all. The pull was not straight back, but up and back. As I pulled the trigger back the RTK Trigger began moving back and upwards on a near 20 degree angle. This made the trigger pull feel very awkward. The shape and angle of the trigger caused my trigger finger to drag on the trigger guard, during the pull. Either one of these issues would have caused me to remove the RTK Trigger. It was a "no brainer" to remove the trigger with both of these problems. I was very disappointed as I was expecting an improvement with the RTK Trigger install. Watch the video at the end of this post to see what I experienced with the RTK Tactical Trigger.

I emailed Ross, the owner of RTK, and explained my position about the trigger and how it could be easily improved. He emailed me back saying he did not want anything to do with me because I "trashed his trigger in public on YouTube." I explained that I did a review on his trigger, and gave my opinion about it. I said if he improved it I would do another review and retract the negative review. Well he did not improve it. He has come out with more styles of the same trigger. They have flashy colors and fancy milling cuts, but they are all based on the original flawed design. I have nothing to gain or lose in a review. I just state my opinion, based on many years involved in Mechanical Engineering and Tool and Die Making. I have many years of working on and modifying guns.

The only trigger that I see as flawed is the RTK Tactical Trigger, which can only be used with the Galloway Precision Trigger Kit. This Tactical trigger flaw is caused mostly from the design to incorporate a trigger overtravel stop into the trigger. If you watch my video, it shows how the design could have been improved while keeping the overtravel stop in place. The rest of the RTK line of triggers should perform fine, as they are all basic style triggers.

Not only is the design of the trigger flawed, but the trigger overtravel stop has limitations with the Galloway Trigger Kit. This is not a fault of the RTK Trigger, but a fault in the Galloway Kit. I have seen posts in this "trigger pull thread" where people have bought the RTK Trigger and can't remove much overtravel. They try to set the overtravel stop to a minimum and their LC9's stop firing. The hammer drops but the firing pin does not clear the firing pin blocker. This is due to the blocker lever not rising high enough due to the overtravel stop limiting the lever's movement.

Back at the end of November 2011, after I installed only the Galloway Hammer in my LC9, I checked the blocker lever lift with the stock trigger bar still installed in my LC9. I emailed Eric Galloway to advise him I found the blocker lever was rising just high enough to allow the firing pin blocker to clear the firing pin and allow the "hit" to the primer. I found it was very close and thought it should have more built in clearance. I told him of my findings and I said that I thought some people might have a problem with this issue. Turns out some people did have a firing pin blocker problem after they installed the Galloway trigger bar with the Galloway hammer. In early December 2011, I modified the "stock" trigger bar to move the trigger break point from the back of the trigger guard to near the middle of the trigger guard. Galloway, at that time, did not have any trigger bars available. About a month later, Galloway's trigger bar eventually came on the market (mid January, 2012), with a similar design to the original trigger bar that I had made.

In mid December I installed a trigger overtravel stop on my LC9, and my gun stopped firing. The blocker lever did not raise high enough to release the firing pin blocker, as the trigger stop limited trigger overtravel and blocker lever lift. I emailed Eric about this problem and he agreed with me that the overtravel stop was limiting the lifting of the blocker lever. I later determined that this problem could be solved by notching the trigger bar tab. The notching of the trigger bar tab does not work using a Galloway trigger bar. It only works by modifying a stock LC9 trigger bar tab and using the Galloway hammer. The modification is shown in my YouTube video #7 ( http://youtu.be/4YMYXuyV2VE ). By notching the trigger bar tab, I did not remove any material from the part of the tab that contacts the blocker lever. I notched only the area of the tab that contacts the hammer, to allow for the hammer reset. My gun now fires fine with ample blocker lever lift. I have cut my total trigger overtravel to less than 1/64 inch.

Those people that purchased the RTK Tactical Trigger for an overtravel stop, are not going to be able to reduce the overtravel by very much, if any. Since the Galloway Trigger Bar has .020 machined off the entire trigger bar tab, this causes the blocker lever to just rise high enough to barely allow the firing pin blocker to clear. As soon as you try to adjust the set screw out, to limit the overtravel, the blocker will not clear, no bang. Hopefully Eric Galloway has redesigned his soon to be released new trigger bars, so that the blocker lever raises high enough that a trigger overtravel stop can be used to it fullest extent.

Watch the following video which explains my complaints about the RTK Trigger. Click on the link at the top of this player. This takes you to YouTube. Then choose full screen at the bottom right of the YouTube video player:

Ruger LC9 with RTK Tactical Trigger Review to Stock & Modified Triggers - YouTube

Bob

creed · July 1st, 2012, 11:37 AM

I love mine the trigger is great I had no problems out of it once it set it go bang every time I have over 1k shot and no miss fire not one

robkarrob · July 5th, 2012, 04:04 PM

Just checked the Galloway web site to see if Eric got his new hammers in. I didn't see anything regarding selling the hammers. Eric had emailed me in late May, saying he was getting the new trigger bars any day and the hammers were on schedule around the end of June. I also noted that most all LC9 items were listed as "out of stock"????

Bob

Pole Kitty · July 6th, 2012, 03:58 PM

Well it’s been a long wait but I finally got a hammer and trigger bar. It didn’t come from Ruger but from another company that apparently has enough clout with Ruger to get them. When I found out that Ruger stopped selling them to the general public, I called and was connected to the top dog in sales (sorry I don’t remember his name) and had a long conversation with him regarding halting sales of these two items. He informed me that Ruger has never sold any part that has to do with the fire control system of their handguns and it was an over sight on their part to offer them. He knew all about what Galloway was doing to enhance the LC9’s trigger pull. I started probing about parts that have been modified if the gun was returned to them for repair and he informed me that factory modified parts would be removed and not returned. In other words, they would fix the gun, but it would be back to factory specs unless the modification caused the problems. This raises another question, has Ruger finally realized that the long trigger pull has started to impede their sells of the LC9, because they are no longer legal Massachusetts. I ask the question “Why such a long trigger pull, not many people like it”? His answer was to be 50 state compliant. Any way back to getting my parts. It took a little over 2 and ½ months to get them. (This started in mid April) The hammer came first and I was informed by email they had it and did I want them to ship it to me. I called and ask them to keep it until the trigger bar comes in and ship everything then. I got an idea about making some extra cash and ask how many hammers do you have in stock now? (I was going to buy them all). The answer was, “sorry yours is the only one we got in and they are no longer available”. So bottom line, they are off to Eric for the mod. I get to keep the original parts in case the gun goes back to Ruger.

robkarrob · July 6th, 2012, 05:55 PM

Checked gallowayprecision.com website today and most all of the items that were listed as "out of stock" yesterday, are today listed as "in stock and shipping".

Bob

mb1911 · July 17th, 2012, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robkarrob

BUT the stock Shield's trigger pull is so much better, and I mean better than a LC9 with the Galloway trigger kit. The trigger is what makes the Shield better. The Shield's bore axis sits 3/16 inch lower than the LC9. In 9mm the Shield has less recoil than the LC9. My Shield 40 has a similar recoil as my LC9, and it is 40 S&W compared to 9mm.

I've been on the fence about my LC9 -- keep it or sell it? The trigger is a big issue for me, as for everyone else. I've been waiting for people to try out fixes -- such as the trigger kit from Galloway -- and Rob's videos and posts has been very informative to me on this journey. Now I see this! I'm not sure what to do, and I'd appreciate any input.

I have a stock LC9. I haven't gotten the Galloway trigger kit, partly because I waited so long for the early adopters to report on it, that by the time I felt confident I'd want to try it, Galloway is all out. But now if the LC9, even with Galloway kit, won't compare to the M&P Shield, then it seems like it's time for me to sign up for something else. Should I still try Galloway's kit when it finally arrives? (Any rumors on the ETA?)

I've played with an M&P 9c. I wasn't a fan of the trigger. Of the compact guns in that range, I prefer the Glock or the XD trigger. Does the Shield have the same trigger, or is it an improvement? (I heard that added a tactile & auditory reset, but what about the trigger pull?)

It seems that the best thing may be to wait for the M&P Shield to become more available, and just trade the LC9 for it. Alternatively, I have my eye on the Sig P938...

jimnor · July 17th, 2012, 06:06 PM

Sorry. Double post.

jimnor · July 17th, 2012, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mb1911

I've been on the fence about my LC9 -- keep it or sell it? The trigger is a big issue for me, as for everyone else. I've been waiting for people to try out fixes -- such as the trigger kit from Galloway -- and Rob's videos and posts has been very informative to me on this journey. Now I see this! I'm not sure what to do, and I'd appreciate any input.

I have a stock LC9. I haven't gotten the Galloway trigger kit, partly because I waited so long for the early adopters to report on it, that by the time I felt confident I'd want to try it, Galloway is all out. But now if the LC9, even with Galloway kit, won't compare to the M&P Shield, then it seems like it's time for me to sign up for something else. Should I still try Galloway's kit when it finally arrives? (Any rumors on the ETA?)

I've played with an M&P 9c. I wasn't a fan of the trigger. Of the compact guns in that range, I prefer the Glock or the XD trigger. Does the Shield have the same trigger, or is it an improvement? (I heard that added a tactile & auditory reset, but what about the trigger pull?)

It seems that the best thing may be to wait for the M&P Shield to become more available, and just trade the LC9 for it. Alternatively, I have my eye on the Sig P938...

For what it's worth, I've fired the 9mm Shield and it is sweet. The trigger is way better than the stock LC9. The pull is relatively short and the reset is a short and positive single click. The sights are easier to aquire as well. But the LC9 with the Galloway trigger kit is also sweet. The pull seems just as short but the reset is longer and it still requires two clicks to full reset. The Galloway kit made such a huge difference for me that I no longer feel I need to replace it with the 9mm Shield. I still am interested in the Shield in 40 cal. however, since that is the niche I still need to fill. But, the Galloway trigger kit saved the LC9 for me. YMMV.

moakes58 · July 17th, 2012, 08:46 PM

39 pages of posts for a very good gun that works fine IF(a big if) you learn how to shoot a DAO trigger properly. That is truly amazing.

mb1911 · July 17th, 2012, 11:07 PM

I don't think I'm the only one: I can shoot DA or DAO without problems, but the ergonomics of the gun has to be better than what LC9 provides. The grip is so tiny that the gun shifts around in my hand. By the time I'm done wrapping the grip in tape, it's as fat as a double stack, which kind of defeats the purpose of having a single stack. The fit to my hand is so poor that after around 20 presses of the trigger, I start feeling this pinch in my hand, and I can no longer break the trigger. I thought I'd get used to the LC9 and overcome this problem, but I never did.

Any advice from the DAO experts?