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Sight 10/22 in a 50 yrds?

This is a discussion on Sight 10/22 in a 50 yrds? within the Ruger 10/22 Rimfire forums, part of the Rifle & Shotgun Forum category; Originally Posted by Iowegan n5npo, The chart I provided assumes the center of the scope is 1.5" above the center of the bore. Scope height ...


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Old January 22nd, 2017, 05:26 AM   #16
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowegan View Post
n5npo, The chart I provided assumes the center of the scope is 1.5" above the center of the bore. Scope height will affect the first crossover point, which happens to be at 21.4 yards in the above chart. Chances are your scope is not at exactly 1.5" above bore line so it may cross over a few yards earlier or later.

Your best bet is to let the trajectory work for you. In this case, the "point blank" distances ranges from 16 to 56 yards. This means .... If the target is within this range, and you aim directly at the target .... no hold over or no hold under ..... the bullet will never strike more than one bullet diameter higher nor one bullet diameter lower than dead center. This is well within the "kill zone" for small game and in fact your 10/22 probably isn't accurate enough to keep shots within 1/2" at 56 yards. After 56 yards, you may have to do a little holdover (aim a bit higher). 70 yards is about the max shooting distance for most 22 LRs so at that distance, you would have to holdover about 1.4". So you could say .... your gun would shoot in a channel that is never more than .6" high and never more than 1.4" low from the muzzle out to 70 yards. At 100 yards, you would have to holdover by 6".

If you sight your scope in at a closer distance, you will forfeit at longer distances .... meaning the bullet will cross the line of sight the second time at 44 yards instead of 50 yards so any distance beyond 44 yards will result in more bullet drop. Personally, I think 50 yard sight in for a 10/22 is just about perfect.
Thanks again sir for the valuable insight and info. What is the software that generated your plot and where might one acquire such a tool?



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Old January 22nd, 2017, 07:32 AM   #17
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n5npo, The software is called "Ballistic Explorer" and is marketed by Dexadine. Here's a link: Dexadine Ballistics Software - ballistic data for shooting and reloading
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Old January 24th, 2017, 05:07 PM   #18
 
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I zeroed my Savage at 100 yards. At 50 yards, it's 2 MOA high, based upon Eley Target.


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Old January 25th, 2017, 04:38 PM   #19
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDRGlock View Post
I zeroed my Savage at 100 yards. At 50 yards, it's 2 MOA high, based upon Eley Target.


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2 moa is 1.04 inches at 50 yards, I would have expected nearly 4 inches high.

My scope has 1/2 MOA clocks. When zeroed at 50 yards, the standard ball-park elevation correction out to 100 is 15 clicks for standard subsonic ammo.

Last edited by kentgoldings; January 25th, 2017 at 04:42 PM.
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Old January 26th, 2017, 05:58 PM   #20
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kentgoldings View Post
2 moa is 1.04 inches at 50 yards, I would have expected nearly 4 inches high.

My scope has 1/2 MOA clocks. When zeroed at 50 yards, the standard ball-park elevation correction out to 100 is 15 clicks for standard subsonic ammo.
Would scope height above bore have any effect on this?
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Old January 26th, 2017, 07:01 PM   #21
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n5npo, If you look at the chart I posted (post #10) you will see the barrel is pointed up so the bullet will rise and intersect with the sight line. If the scope is mounted higher, the barrel must be pointed up just a little bit more to intersect with the line of sight. Obviously this will change the trajectory. The opposite happens when the scope is mounted lower because the barrel isn't pointed up quite as much. When you use iron sights, the barrel is still pointed up but very slightly, therefore the bullet path will be flatter out to 50 yards, then it will start dropping.
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Old January 27th, 2017, 04:10 PM   #22
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n5npo View Post
Would scope height above bore have any effect on this?
Scope height above the bore is a matter of ergonomics. You wanna be looking straight through the scope when you have your cheek comfortable rested against the comb. When you do this, you want no muscle tension in your neck. Traditional rifle stocks that accommodate open sights require that a scope be mounted as close to the barrel as practical. But, scope dimensions vary. My savage axis 2 XP has a bolt agle that requires a bit of a scope height so that the bolt can actuate. The stock has a high enough comb to compensate and there are no iron sights. My Mossberg 340BD has a rear apeture sight mounted on the back of the receiver. You can't put a scope on it without requiring a cheek pad. It is a good idea to hold and mount any rifle before you buy it in order to check the scope height. This will save you costly modifications later.

Scope height has no effect on the trajectory of a bull it after it leaves the barrel. A 22LR bullet fired from a muzzle parallel to target 50 yards away with a functioning aiming system zeroed at 50 yards will follow the same trajectory regardless of the aiming system.

If the scope height is excessively above the barrel, the scope may not be able to zero at extreme ranges. The problem can be solved by special scope mounts or shims. But, it may be impossible to zero the scope at shorter ranges. Scopes have a finite range of height adjustment. Expensive scopes have more. Cheaper scopes have less. I had a Marlin XT 17 with factory mounted scope bases installed so crooked, you couldn't zero less expensive scopes. I needed windage compensating scope mounts to fix it.

Last edited by kentgoldings; January 27th, 2017 at 04:19 PM.
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Old January 27th, 2017, 09:52 PM   #23
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowegan View Post
n5npo, If you look at the chart I posted (post #10) you will see the barrel is pointed up so the bullet will rise and intersect with the sight line. If the scope is mounted higher, the barrel must be pointed up just a little bit more to intersect with the line of sight. Obviously this will change the trajectory. The opposite happens when the scope is mounted lower because the barrel isn't pointed up quite as much. When you use iron sights, the barrel is still pointed up but very slightly, therefore the bullet path will be flatter out to 50 yards, then it will start dropping.
Finally an explanation that makes sense about mounting a scope as low as possible. Thanks!
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Old January 28th, 2017, 03:13 AM   #24
 
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The muzzle elevation slightly reduces the horizontal component of the muzzle velocity will giving it a slight upward component. This is interesting to think about. It does mean that sight mounting will change the geometry slightly.


The actual reduction factor ideally should be the cosine of the angle. The cosine of 20 MOA differs from one in the seventh decimal place. Therefore the effect on bullet drop will be nearly zero.

So, I'm assuming that the angle of the barrel is going to be much larger. I have no experience in these matters. I just mount the scope as low has the rifle accommodates and take any computed trajectories with a grain of salt until it shoot myself. I'm not sure heroic efforts to modify a rifle to lower the scope is entirely constructive.

But, I can't fault anyone who stresses the details. I've been caught weighing my brass and adding powder grains to pan grain-by-grain.

In the end, it comes to that moment when your breathing slows, you stop your heart, and gently squeeze. If you get that wrong, none of this matters,

Last edited by kentgoldings; January 28th, 2017 at 09:44 AM.
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Old January 28th, 2017, 07:01 AM   #25
 
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I cannot thank you guys enough for all the help and expertise. The reason I asked about the scope center height above center of bore height is because I noticed how high the scope is above bore center on my AR vs. the 10/22, my Ruger American .30-06 and most other conventional fire arms. This made me wonder if elevated scope had some advantages as far having two zero's at far distances, such as with an AR set to a 50yrd zero and a 225 yard zero. I saw this on a you tube video. But in the end I did not realize how limiting the .22lr's velocity was. I must learn more about bullet velocity and ballistics.
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Old February 10th, 2017, 04:04 PM   #26
 
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I sighted my target model in at 50 yards. There's about a 9" drop at 100yds
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