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Fit and finish issues

This is a discussion on Fit and finish issues within the Ruger 10/22 Rimfire forums, part of the Rifle & Shotgun Forum category; I was going back and forth over which 22semi auto to buy. A friend convinced me that a 10-22 was the way to go. It's ...


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Old December 31st, 2016, 07:00 PM   #1
 
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Unhappy Fit and finish issues

I was going back and forth over which 22semi auto to buy. A friend convinced me that a 10-22 was the way to go. It's not that I'm a gun newby: I've competed in IHMSA, skeet, avid hunter (love big bore pistols, and heavy rifles). Never found a need for another 22 rifle other than the one my father taught me to shoot with.
Anyway, age has affected my near vision so iron sights aren't an option which is all that little Remington knock off of a Browing SA-22 will accommodate. Hence the quest for a newer generation rifle that could accommodate optics.

I found a nice used Deluxe Sporter that fit me well, and had a walnut rather than painted birch or flimsy plastic stock. Price seemed right, so brought it home. I haven't fired it yet, having decided to go through the gun first to look for obvious opportunities for improvement. OMG!!

The wood was positively furry inside do to the lack of any attention to the final fit. So many high/lows in the barrel channel plus 'tufts' from the rough routing that it is anybodies guess where the barrel would rest from one shot to the next. I smoothed that some with some very fine paper, then started paying attention to the receiver fit.

Darned pins fell out every time I looked at the receiver. I can understand the trigger retention pins being a little loose, but the bolt stop and magazine release pins too? Then I realized the receiver barrel assembly could not stay centered - there is easily a sixteenth gap on either side of the receiver which means a total side to side of an eighth or more from shot to shot. It looks like the previous owner already replaced the takedown screw with an Allen head and partially crushed the wood bed trying to stop the movement. I don't see this gun keeping a 2" group at 50 yards.

The trigger I expected - I've owned many Ruger pistols and the hard/rough triggers are just st a 'feature' of the Ruger line.

But really - in what world does this gun at its price point considered acceptable quality? Ruger 10-22 are not inexpensive compared to similar competitors ( Rem 597, Marlin, Savage), and the rotary magazine alone does not justify the price delta, nice as it is.

My fix for the moment is to install a BX-25 trigger and a Hogue stock - taking advantage of the aftermarket to fix or mitigate the manufacturing issues. My problem is not the burgeoning 3rd party solutions, but that QC at Ruger has made them a necessity.



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Old December 31st, 2016, 11:33 PM   #2
 
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I hope you find happiness. You bought a used Ruger, have not even shot it yet, but are already complaining about all the ways the rifle is deficient. It is a Ruger. They are made to shoot and be affordable. Many, many shooters have been very satisfied with the performance of their 10/22 rifle. The millions sold are evidence of that. The aftermarket has provided accessories of all types so that every shooter can have a 10/22 configured exactly to their needs. It sounds like you are more interested in something fancy to show off than in an everyday gun like a 10/22.
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Old January 1st, 2017, 12:54 AM   #3
 
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I'm surprised that such a nice rifle is in that condition. I just bought the "cheaper" Lipsey's version of your rifle called the Sporter. It has the hardwood stock instead of walnut (that's why mine is a Sporter not a Deluxe Sporter) and the fit and finish is very good.

Ironically, the reason I bought mine was because it had a great trigger. It's the same that's on any standard 1022 but it just came out of production with a lighter trigger pull at 4 3/4 lbs. Great for accuracy but safe for a small game hunting rifle.

It's unfortunate that you have to put more money into a gun to make it usable. Good luck.
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Old January 1st, 2017, 01:27 AM   #4
 
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It's a cheap $200 autoloading plinker...........not sure what you would expect in terms of fit and finish. They have never been very good in those areas. That's why companies like Kidd are making lots of money. Have probably owned 50 10/22s in my lifetime. Never had one I considered really nice. They are what they are
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Old January 1st, 2017, 05:12 AM   #5
 
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You bought a used 10/22, a mass produced assembly line .22lr plinker. You think they'll take the time to use resources to finally finish the inside of a stock? You want finally finished and precisely fit, you spend the money.
The pins...they're not going anyplace loose or not once the action is in the stock. Nothing about the two you mentioned being loose effects anything negligible in performance.
Once tightened properly, how's that barrel going to move that 1/16"?
Lets look also at... You haven't even fired it yet already jumping onto the "it's not going to shoot" platform. Knowing this so forthright, I'm curious why you didn't look over the gun a bit closer before filling out the 4473 and paying for it.

Maybe it's a bit relative but the 10/22's ARE a budget rifle and ARE indeed inexpensive contrary to your opinion. Comparing them to the other makes... Well, consider how much talks and discussions are about those models. How often are they touted for fine fit and wonderfully finishes?

Perhaps this isn't as much about the disappointment in the gun itself but a bit on not taking the time to check it over first yourself. After all, if you expect the folks at Ruger to do this, certainly you could as well.
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Old January 1st, 2017, 11:06 AM   #6
 
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Kidd 10/22 is what your after if fit and finish is important.

10/22® and Ruger® 10/22® aftermarket trigger, barrel and parts by KIDD Innovative Design
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Old January 14th, 2017, 06:13 AM   #7
 
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What they said ^^^^


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Old February 1st, 2017, 04:33 PM   #8
 
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Sounds like a normal 10/22 to me as well, let's be honest here, in factory form, these guns are built to hit a price point, they're a good, solid, sturdy plinking/varminting gun, nothing more.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not badmouthing the 10/22 in the slightest, I think it's an amazing design, simple and robust, if anything, the fire control components are *over* engineered/overbuilt for the humble .22LR cartridge, as a technician, I love the thought that clearly went into the design, there's a reason the gun has survived this long largely unchanged and is still going strong

That said, in factory form, it's no Anschutz, Cooper, or even CZ in terms of fit/finish/accuracy, but it *CAN* be built up to that level, and beyond if you want, that's what the aftermarket is for.

Personally, I'm happy with my used Design Contest Winner in its lightly modified form, every mod I made to it was to "fix" a problem *I* had with it, it was perfectly fine in its stock form...

KIDD Bolt buffer; reduce the "KLAK" from the bolt cycling and soften the impact on the bolt's rear travel
Auto bolt release; convenience, mainly, the standard bolt lock/unlock is counterintuitive
TacSol magazine release lever; leftover part from a previous 10/22, so why not?
BX trigger group; I was too impatient to send the factory group to Brimstone for work, and the BX was at my local shop 5 miles down the road from home (I'll send the spare factory group to Brimstone eventually...)
KIDD oversized trigger group pins; factory pins fit too loosely
PWS Raptor stock; it was on clearance, I like the looks, and I prefer wood stocks over plastic, even well-made plastics like the DCW
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Old February 2nd, 2017, 12:18 PM   #9
 
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I have to agree with the other posters. If you are looking for an excellent plinker, you've probably found it. If you're looking for a looker, buy a Cooper or something of that ilk.

A friend of mine has a $5000 Anschutz Biathlon rig. Offhand at 50 yards, my 10/22 Takedown, with a Kidd single stage trigger shoots within a 1/4 of an inch of his rifle. I think that's pretty amazing, especially when you consider my rifle (with Kidd trigger and a Nikon M-223 1.5-6x24 BDC 600 IL scope.) cost me under $950.00 USD!
(Bipod mount for 10/22 Takedown, without forend!)

My 10/22 is ugly... but it shoots!

How is your 10/22 grouping?
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Old February 7th, 2017, 02:47 PM   #10
 
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Cyendrey, I am an "old dude" who bought his first-ever firearm right at 2 years ago, a 10/22TD. I put in a bolt-buffer as well as one of those quick-release bolt locks. I also remember my first time taking it down to install those items and encountering what you did ...

"MAN-OH-MAN-OH-MANISCHEVITZ! I've BROKEN the darn thing and it's still BRAND NEW!"

Well, I didn't lose anything and was able to get it all back together, with no parts extra or bent.

As I read more and more, I saw that everybody who shared advice/instruction offered a warning about those pins deciding to do their own thing. Now, I've come a piece since then, but I never forget the good advice. So, these days, when I break it down (for cleaning or whatever) I try to keep it all as "vertical" as possible and I always, but always, have my Craftsman magnetic tray close at hand.

FWIW and hang in there,
Steve in Memphis
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Old February 7th, 2017, 05:58 PM   #11
 
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Cyendrey, I bought my first 10-22 back around 1971-72, in fact I still have it, with the walnut stock and all. Back then the wood to metal fit was pretty precise. It did have a very heavy trigger pull way back then, compared to what I was used to; So I invested some money and replaced the sear, hammer, and trigger with a Volquartzen (Spelling), and placed a little 4X Burris scope on it. I would estimate that me and my 4 sons put at least 10,000rounds thru that 10-22 without a problem. It still looks like new, as I do take care of my firearms.

Recently I purchased another 10-22 as I've always liked the Mannlicher stock, this time I got the 10-22 International. The wood to metal fit on this rifle is in my opinion very good, note it is walnut, after installing a Ruger BMX trigger assembly, and installing a sling, and a set of peep sights, don't remember the brand off hand, however the internal wood was well finished with there oil finish.

All the rumors I heard was that a Mannlicher stock was not conducive to accuracy in any known rifle using such a stock. Well I beg to differ with the non-believers; using CCI Standard velocity .22LR, at a measured 50 yards I was able to place all 10 shots out of the stock barrel in one raggedy hole with all the rounds touching. BTW this was repeatable at that range.

Some day I will probably go with a KIDD trigger assembly, or go with a Volquartzen hammer, sear, and trigger, but for right now I'm perfectly content with that rifle just the way it is.
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Old February 10th, 2017, 04:55 PM   #12
 
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I have a 10/22 target model with a heavy barrel and target trigger. I couldn't be happier with the gun. It takes any ammo I feed it and is very accurate. I don't think you can find better for the money
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Old February 11th, 2017, 03:23 PM   #13
 
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My 10/22 has been one of the most accurate firearms in my fleet.
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Old February 12th, 2017, 10:02 AM   #14
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyendrey View Post
I was going back and forth over which 22semi auto to buy. A friend convinced me that a 10-22 was the way to go. It's not that I'm a gun newby: I've competed in IHMSA, skeet, avid hunter (love big bore pistols, and heavy rifles). Never found a need for another 22 rifle other than the one my father taught me to shoot with.
Anyway, age has affected my near vision so iron sights aren't an option which is all that little Remington knock off of a Browing SA-22 will accommodate. Hence the quest for a newer generation rifle that could accommodate optics.

I found a nice used Deluxe Sporter that fit me well, and had a walnut rather than painted birch or flimsy plastic stock. Price seemed right, so brought it home. I haven't fired it yet, having decided to go through the gun first to look for obvious opportunities for improvement. OMG!!

The wood was positively furry inside do to the lack of any attention to the final fit. So many high/lows in the barrel channel plus 'tufts' from the rough routing that it is anybodies guess where the barrel would rest from one shot to the next. I smoothed that some with some very fine paper, then started paying attention to the receiver fit.

Darned pins fell out every time I looked at the receiver. I can understand the trigger retention pins being a little loose, but the bolt stop and magazine release pins too? Then I realized the receiver barrel assembly could not stay centered - there is easily a sixteenth gap on either side of the receiver which means a total side to side of an eighth or more from shot to shot. It looks like the previous owner already replaced the takedown screw with an Allen head and partially crushed the wood bed trying to stop the movement. I don't see this gun keeping a 2" group at 50 yards.

The trigger I expected - I've owned many Ruger pistols and the hard/rough triggers are just st a 'feature' of the Ruger line.

But really - in what world does this gun at its price point considered acceptable quality? Ruger 10-22 are not inexpensive compared to similar competitors ( Rem 597, Marlin, Savage), and the rotary magazine alone does not justify the price delta, nice as it is.

My fix for the moment is to install a BX-25 trigger and a Hogue stock - taking advantage of the aftermarket to fix or mitigate the manufacturing issues. My problem is not the burgeoning 3rd party solutions, but that QC at Ruger has made them a necessity.
Fit finish and QC is all a function of money. Your problems are imagined. The pins and simple when putting back together. 2 wraps of black electrical tape keeps the pins from falling out unless you want them out. I have crushed nothing and there is a torque setting for the take down screw. I am a new guy at target shooting as far as rounds downrange and I can shoot on a day good day for me a 3/8 to 1/2 inch group with the same gun. So the gun capable it is all up to me and the wind.
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Old February 12th, 2017, 05:42 PM   #15
 
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Fit and finish, Ruger............................................. ..... Shoot it you'll love it.
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