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Poor extraction

This is a discussion on Poor extraction within the Ruger 10/22 Rimfire forums, part of the Rifle & Shotgun Forum category; My old mid-1980's runs like a champ with about anything I shoot in it. My wife's 10/22, however, is about a dozen years old and ...


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Old March 8th, 2014, 07:30 PM   #1
 
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Poor extraction

My old mid-1980's runs like a champ with about anything I shoot in it. My wife's 10/22, however, is about a dozen years old and has always been somewhat problematic. Feeding, extraction, and ejection are not reliable. I was tinkering with it the other day and noticed that the extractor does not have a very good grip on the rim of the cartridge. The cartridge is often left completely in the chamber. It is sometimes pulled part way out.

I have a new extractor on order. What other suggestions do you folks have that might help me fix the problem?



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Old March 9th, 2014, 04:59 AM   #2
 
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Change ammo.
Make sure the chamber is clean.
Make sure the extractor is centered in it's slot on the barrel - not rubbing it.
Weak extractor spring?

If there's issues with feeding and ejection too, there's more to the issue. Does this happen with all magazines used? Are they factory or aftermarket magazines? Happen with all ammo?
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Old March 9th, 2014, 05:03 AM   #3
 
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Slick the bolt up at the contact points & round off the back bottom edge maybe
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Old March 9th, 2014, 06:10 AM   #4
 
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Poor extraction

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bell Swamp View Post
My old mid-1980's runs like a champ with about anything I shoot in it. My wife's 10/22, however, is about a dozen years old and has always been somewhat problematic. Feeding, extraction, and ejection are not reliable. I was tinkering with it the other day and noticed that the extractor does not have a very good grip on the rim of the cartridge. The cartridge is often left completely in the chamber. It is sometimes pulled part way out.



I have a new extractor on order. What other suggestions do you folks have that might help me fix the problem?

The extractor doesn't "pull" the shell casing from the chamber, excerpt if manually cycling the bolt. When a round is fired the shell casing pushes from the chamber due to blowback ( the gasses and recoil effect from the round going down the barrel). If the round stays in the chamber clean the chamber good, there is some sort of imperfection there putting friction on the casing making it stick, OR, The recoil spring is way too stiff or the recoil rod is dirty/bent etc. if you shoot sub sonics they may cause this. The function of the extractor on normal firing is to hold the rim of the casing so the casing is held in the bolt face cutout, until the ejector deflects the casing to the right outside the action.

If the casing not coming out of the chamber on manual cycling, a new extractor is needed. I always keep several on hand. For your wife's gun, clean the interior of the receiver, and try to lightly sand or polish any rough areas on the inside top or sides. Also do the same to the bolt. It can help a lot. You could put your bolt in her gun and see if it improves. That would tell you where the issue lies. If it is her bolt try to round the lower rear of the bolt radius to reduce friction between the hammer and bolt. This makes the bolt move better. My older 10/22 bolts (from the 70's and 80's) have no issues. The newer ones are not as good IMHO. So I polish the inside of the receiver and the bolts after my first trip to the range. I also ensure the bolt is lubricated on the top sides and bottom to reduce friction. After my first trip I look for signs of wear inside the receiver. I start my polishing at those areas.

Last edited by CmdrCody; March 9th, 2014 at 10:04 AM.
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Old March 9th, 2014, 09:37 AM   #5
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CmdrCody
.... a new extractor is needed. I always keep several on hand.
Interesting.

I lost track of how many rounds I put through one 10/22 but it was
WAY North of 30K, when I did my rebuild. In that rebuild I did not
change out the extractor, and I still have not had extraction issues.

I think you may be over complicating the issue.
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Old March 9th, 2014, 09:39 AM   #6
 
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I'll be the new extractor fixes the problem. Did you order a new OEM or one from Volquartsen? Hopefully your new extractor comes with a new spring too.
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Old March 9th, 2014, 09:57 AM   #7
 
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Poor extraction

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat-inCO View Post
Interesting.



I lost track of how many rounds I put through one 10/22 but it was

WAY North of 30K, when I did my rebuild. In that rebuild I did not

change out the extractor, and I still have not had extraction issues.



I think you may be over complicating the issue.

Well if you pick and choose which words you pay attention to you aren't very bright. The statement was "IF YOU MANUALLY CYCLE THE BOLT AND THE CASING IS NOT COMING OUT YOU NEED A NEW EXTRACTOR. You just quoted the you need a new extractor. Not a fair quote of a post. I keep extras because I keep extra parts for anything that can fail. I didn't say how many spring sets I have also. I always keep spare parts.

Last edited by CmdrCody; March 9th, 2014 at 10:02 AM.
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Old March 9th, 2014, 10:02 AM   #8
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CmdrCody View Post
The extractor doesn't "pull" the shell casing from the chamber, excerpt if manually cycling the bolt. When a round is fired the shell casing pushes from the chamber due to blowback ( the gasses and recoil effect from the round going down the barrel). If the round stays in the chamber clean the chamber good, there is some sort of imperfection there putting friction on the casing making it stick, OR, The recoil spring is way too stiff or the recoil rod is dirty/bent etc. if you shoot sub sonics they may cause this. The function of the extractor on normal firing is to hold the rim of the casing so the casing is held in the bolt face cutout, until the ejector deflects the casing to the left outside the action.

If the casing not coming out of the chamber on manual cycling, a new extractor is needed. I always keep several on hand. For your wife's gun, clean the interior of the receiver, and try to lightly sand or polish any rough areas on the inside top or sides. Also do the same to the bolt. It can help a lot. You could put your bolt in her gun and see if it improves. That would tell you where the issue lies. If it is her bolt try to round the lower rear of the bolt radius to reduce friction between the hammer and bolt. This makes the bolt move better. My older 10/22 bolts (from the 70's and 80's) have no issues. The newer ones are not as good IMHO. So I polish the inside of the receiver and the bolts after my first trip to the range. I also ensure the bolt is lubricated on the top sides and bottom to reduce friction. After my first trip I look for signs of wear inside the receiver. I start my polishing at those areas.
Well stated and excellent advice!
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Old March 9th, 2014, 12:57 PM   #9
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Pat-inCO, Your situation is normal ... most factory extractors work quite well. However, it is also very common to get a factory defective extractor. They are a stamped part that sometimes just don't work right. Any time you experience stovepipes or feeding problems, the very first thing to check is the extractor because it plays a roll in both scenarios. I like two aftermarket brands .... Power Custom and Volquartsen. They are machined ... not stamped and almost always fix extraction problems. The best 12 bucks you can spend on a 10/22 to end ammo fussiness. BTW, Ruger MK Series pistols use the same exact extractors and often suffer from the same exact problems. Same solution.
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Old March 16th, 2014, 08:27 PM   #10
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CmdrCody View Post
The extractor doesn't "pull" the shell casing from the chamber, excerpt if manually cycling the bolt. When a round is fired the shell casing pushes from the chamber due to blowback ( the gasses and recoil effect from the round going down the barrel). If the round stays in the chamber clean the chamber good, there is some sort of imperfection there putting friction on the casing making it stick, OR, The recoil spring is way too stiff or the recoil rod is dirty/bent etc. if you shoot sub sonics they may cause this. The function of the extractor on normal firing is to hold the rim of the casing so the casing is held in the bolt face cutout, until the ejector deflects the casing to the right outside the action.

If the casing not coming out of the chamber on manual cycling, a new extractor is needed. I always keep several on hand. For your wife's gun, clean the interior of the receiver, and try to lightly sand or polish any rough areas on the inside top or sides. Also do the same to the bolt. It can help a lot. You could put your bolt in her gun and see if it improves. That would tell you where the issue lies. If it is her bolt try to round the lower rear of the bolt radius to reduce friction between the hammer and bolt. This makes the bolt move better. My older 10/22 bolts (from the 70's and 80's) have no issues. The newer ones are not as good IMHO. So I polish the inside of the receiver and the bolts after my first trip to the range. I also ensure the bolt is lubricated on the top sides and bottom to reduce friction. After my first trip I look for signs of wear inside the receiver. I start my polishing at those areas.
WOW I sure learned a lot from those 2 paragraphs.
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Old March 17th, 2014, 06:50 PM   #11
 
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I put in a new extractor from Numrich and have not noticed much difference. Hand cycling does not throw a live round out very well as it does in my other 10/22 rifles and leaves most of them in the receiver. I have a different brand extractor coming and will see if that makes a difference. I might take the rifle out tomorrow to see how it shoots with the new extractor.

I suppose I do need to swap out a few parts one at a time with another rifle to pinpoint which part is giving the trouble.
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Old March 18th, 2014, 02:51 AM   #12
 
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Poor extraction

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bell Swamp View Post
I put in a new extractor from Numrich and have not noticed much difference. Hand cycling does not throw a live round out very well as it does in my other 10/22 rifles and leaves most of them in the receiver. I have a different brand extractor coming and will see if that makes a difference. I might take the rifle out tomorrow to see how it shoots with the new extractor.

I suppose I do need to swap out a few parts one at a time with another rifle to pinpoint which part is giving the trouble.

As I tried telling you before, clean your chamber really good. Any imperfection or build up there can hold the round in. You have never answered what brand ammo you are using. On some ammo the coating on the bullet can actually create friction that hold the round in. What model 10/22 did your wife purchase? Just wondering what chamber it is.

Last edited by CmdrCody; March 18th, 2014 at 02:55 AM.
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Old March 18th, 2014, 08:53 AM   #13
 
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The chamber is clean. I have had the problem with CCI, Remington, Federal, Winchester, and Aguilla ammo. The ammo does not seem to make much of a difference except that the Remington I have often fails to fire in her 10/22 and in about every other 22 firearm I have. Her 10/22 is a 250- series in 22 LR that is blue with a plastic stock.

I did a little tinkering this morning to see if I could swap out parts between two different 10/22's to see if I could pinpoint the problem. I was not able to fire the rifles but rather judged whether they were working properly by trying to eject live rounds by hand. That may not be a conclusive test, but the other 10/22's I have that work properly eject the rounds very well and do not leave them partially in the chamber or sitting on top of the next round in the magazine.

I swapped parts between a properly working 120-series and the problematic 250- series. I used several different factory magazines and Federal, Remington, and Aguilla ammo. All cartridges could fall out of either chamber very easily.


Receiver Bolt Barrel Results

120- 120- 120- excellent
120- 250- 120- fair
120- 250- 250- very poor
120- 120- 250- very poor

250- 250- 250- very poor
250- 120- 250- very poor
250- 120- 120- excellent
250- 250- 120- fair

The combination of the 120- barrel and 120- bolt gave excellent results in both receivers. The 250- bolt gave only fair results in both receivers with the 120- barrel.
The 250- barrel gave very poor results in all combinations.

I have another extractor on the way and will try it in the 250- bolt with the 120- barrel.

The 250- barrel seems to be the main problem. The extractor cut in the barrel does not seem to be as deep or as close to the chamber as the cuts in the other 10/22's I have.

I suppose it might have to go back to Ruger if the new extractor does not work.
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Old March 18th, 2014, 10:47 AM   #14
 
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Be sure to install the Ruger extractor back in as they want a stock as shipped rifle.
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Old March 19th, 2014, 08:23 PM   #15
 
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I am having a similar issue with my 10/22 semi-auto. I either get a stovepipe or the spent ammo cartridge gets stuck. It's only 2 weeks old and have put almost 200 rounds through it. Started marking my magazines to see if it's the same one. All the magazines are Ruger brand with steel lips. I have also tried Federal, Remington and Aguilla as well as another one that escapes me at the moment, so my guess is it's not the ammo. Guess I will try cleaning it and seeing if that helps.
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